Brass in the oven

[borderman]

I have begun washing brass in a Purple Power solution and then rinsing in water with vinegar. Would it be okay to dry the brass in the oven at about 250 degrees for an hour or so? Any danger to the brass at that temperature?

[Ricochet]

I've dried it at about 220F without apparent harm. I'll bet cases get kicked out of some semiautos about that hot.

[felix]

Yes, far too high! Brass can be as hot as Ricochet says for a few minutes, but not for an hour. The brass will be dry in no time using a heating vent, like in front of the ice box, which does not get nearly that hot. 100 degrees all day won't hurt anything. ... felix

[borderman]

Well I haven't gone over 200 degrees for 15 minutes yet, but there was still water around the primer area, thus the question. I will be more patient in the future.

Thanks guys,

[monadnock#5]

A friend told me to wash case lube off by washing in dawn detergent and rinsing with water. Dry them in a 200° oven for ten or fifteen minutes. He was quite emphatic about not going over 200° so as not to soften the brass. Good plan, but it didn't work for me. I found drops of water inside the cases even though the exteriors were dry. My solution was to tap the water out of each case on a folded newspaper, and then stand each case up case neck down on my wife's broiler pan insert. The insert holds a .308 case neck perfectly. With this method ten or fifteen minutes is more than enough time to dry the cases thoroughly.
Ken

[Dale53]

When I was shooting BPCR Silhouette, I made "racks" for my cases. I pre-drilled small blocks (size of a cartridge block) and then set long finish nails in those holes (drive in fit). Stainless nails are better if you can find them. After washing my 40-65 cases, I turned them upside down on the nails. They air dried in record time. The nails need to be long enough that the cases do not touch the block. If you are in a hurry and the sun is shining, you can set the filled blocks in the sun - this speeds the drying with perfect safety. Of course, you can do the same thing with the oven at low temperature, if you prefer. I never was in THAT much of a hurry.

Dale53

[versifier]

Felix,
Dang it, you went and made me think again!
OK, so why is it not a good idea to occasionally leave the brass in the oven for awhile?
Won't it anneal?
Won't that help it to last longer?
Or does the heat affect it adversely over time where annealing is a quicker process?
(I know the annealing process with brass is the opposite for brass and steel - heating and rapid quenching hardens steel, but it softens brass and bronze. To anneal iron alloys you heat them and let them cool slowly.) Heat treating stabilizes the structure of iron alloys.
What does it do to copper alloys?
How do cryo treatments effect brass and bronze?
Does anyone have that info handy?
Start a man to thinking and chances are there are going to be questions. The better the start, the more interesting the questions.

[felix]

Copper-zinc and lead-antimony-tin are different in their heat treating characteristics. Both are a function of time and heat, but the former heat-treat relies upon the product of the two, and the latter upon the differential of the product. Both require a certain amount of heat: the former begins at about 200 degrees and the latter at about 300 degrees. This means that any heat below these numbers is safe for practical purposes. Anything above can be suspect, and depends on the alloy composition percentages. When making brass softer care must be taken as to not make the base too soft, especially in a non-BR chamber which typically has excessive dimensions. In addition, a BR action (extreme duty) will hold case dimensions in the situation of a charge too high. This means a softer case will not stick in a BR chamber with the same charge.

I don't know about cyro treatment of brass. I would expect it would be short lived and therefore not cost effective. Did you know that just about all Japan made tools are cyro treated? This has been going on since WW2 over there. It could be that this was done to some of their barreled actions before the war ended. This is why I could never contradict Joe Starmetal and his love for their guns.

felix

[MGySgt]

When I was washing cases, I would run hot tap water over them to heat them up and then spread them on a towel to dry over night.

Someone a long time ago warned me about leting them in a oven, even on Warm too long would shorten the working life of a case.

FWIW

Drew

[monadnock#5]

Dale53,
Speed is of the essence in some situations. At this time of year, damp brass within a five foot radius of the woodstove will dry the brass quickly and in any position they get left in. However, in the middle of summer here in NH, when the sun is just a bright spot in the mist, waiting for brass to air dry can be quite frustrating. And I hate to admit it, but sometimes I have found myself processing brass on Saturday for a match on Sunday,and on more than one occasion. Lastly, when utilizing kitchen space, tools and equipment, it's a lot better to get the job done before the Alpha Female detects that anything is amiss. It saves a tremendous amount of sniveling and whining and carrying on. I hate being reduced to such histrionics.
Ken

[Marshal Kane]

Prefer to wash my fired cases in detergent and allow them to airdry. Have found that the shorter cases fit very well in those plastic bullet holders that factories supply for handgun bullets. The holders allow the cases to be placed casemouth down for easy drainage. To speed up the drying, place the blocks in the sun, use a hairdryer (when the wife isn't there) or place the bullet holder on a heater register while the furnace is functioning.

[versifier]

Thank you felix, that was the missing puzzle piece. As to the cryo, if it were cost effective, they'd be doing it, I just wondered how it affects the crystal structure of copper alloys and would it make positive or negative changes in cartridge brass or bronze.
monadnock#5,
I totally agree about the woodstove. In fact, I think it is also an essential element in cleaning (and then drying) M/L barrels, too. Just set the barrel on top of the stove for a few minutes and everything is dry and ready to be oiled for storage. My present situation is sans woodstove and the oven is too small to fit the barrel into. PITA.
Probably aren't too many here get your handle, but we have NH members on the coast, south central, and two of us in the MWValley. Where do you shoot? My brother lives down in P'boro.

[eka]

I wash my cases in a combination of hot water, Dawn, automatic dish detergent, and phosphoric acid (Parks prep and prime). I use a five gallon bucket with a smaller bucket inside with holes drilled in it. The cases go in the smaller bucket, therefore you can wash several different calibers and keep them seperate. After washing my cases, I get as much of the water out of them as possible. I use one of those plastic discs for riding in the snow. I drillled some holes in it and move the brass around on it until most of the water is gone. In the summer, I spread the brass out in the hot sun. In the winter, I turn the oven on to 170 degrees F and put the brass in on an old cookie sheet. When the oven reaches 170, I turn the oven off and let it cool back down with the brass in it. There is no chance that way of over heating the brass and damaging it. Most of the time, the cases are dry if I got most of the water out. If not, repeat.

Keith

[monadnock#5]

Hello versifier.
I do belong to Peterborough Sportsmen's Club and have probably crossed paths with your brother at some point. The 2007 Cheshire-Windham Small Bore Rifle League season will start in January. In the summer you might find me at the Cheshire Co. Fish and Game Club in Keene where I also hold a membership. For Sunday NH HP Matches, I'll be the one shooting the M1A. I think I'm the last man on the Keene team that still shoots that ancient relic.
Ken

[rebliss]

Just a thought that I have not tried, but have not seen mentioned so far here:

Would a rinsing agent help this process? After washing and rinsing the brass, a few drops of JetDry to the final rinse water should eliminate the tendency of the water to bead up, and may decrease drying time.

Also, an alcohol rinse would tend to break up the surface tension of the water, and also dry more quickly. A bottle of isopropol alcohol is only about $.50.

And chemical problems with using either of these methods that anyone is aware of? Anyone tried it?

[Blackwater]

Some time in the hazy past, I tried washing in hot soapy water, and then shaking dry in a collander. Then I'd immerse in acetone, which would absorb any water left in the cases, and then I'd shake nearly dry in the collander again. The acetone evaporates quickly, and by the time I had my loading set up, the cases were pretty much dry. FWIW.

Water doesn't evaporate and dry nearly as fast as acetone. Application of a hair dryer hastens the evap post haste, too, but if you heat very much, watch out for teeny flames if you get the solvent too hot.

[montana_charlie]

I drop fired (BP) cases in a jug of water with a bit of Dawn added, and let 'em soak until I have time to clean them. Then, it's 30 minutes in an ultrasonic machine. After a hot water rinse, they are put in a rack, mouth down. and shot with compressed air to blast water out of the primer pockets. Then, air dried, cuz I'm never in a hurry.

I have recently acquired a rotary tumbler, so I plan to polish them up after five or ten loadings. Now, I'm looking for a cheap source for that ceramic tumbling medium...
CM

[tommag]

I used two #10 cans for a dryer. I cut a hole big enough to fit the nozzle of a hair dryer near the bottom of one and drilled a bunch of holes in the bottom of the other one. Then I taped the perforated one to the top of the other one. Put the brass in the top can and place the hairdryer next to the big hole in the bottom can. (not quite in it, to avoid water dripping on the dryer) Using the low setting, it will dry the brass in 10 minutes or so. If you use the high setting, the brass gets too hot to handle.

[Jon K]

Charlie,

Do a search on ceramic media, over on Shiloh Forum. I recall several sources mentioned, I don't knw how much.
Although, initial cost is not cheap, the ceramic media will last longer than you or I will. For BP brass-the brass has never been so clean. Once you use it, you'll be so happy, you'll never look back.

Have Fun Shooting,
Jon
:castmine:

[Jon K]

I usually am not in a rush, so I just put the wet brass on a dry towel, then put them on a drying rack I got from Cabela's(on sale now $5.99). If I am in a rush, I will shake the wet brass in the towel, shake, then put it in the vibratory tumbler with the top open, for about 10-20 minutes til dry.
Lots of ways to do the same thing.

Have Fun Shooting,
Jon
:castmine:

[bobthenailer]

ive been washing my brass with a lorton lapadairy { rock} tumbler for over 20 years , with a soultion of joy dish washing detergent and bb gun bbs. in the summer they dry in the sun in colder days i use a old toster oven and set the temp to 175 degrees and let them go for about 20 to 30 minutes and then cool down, ive never experinced any problems, and i wash my brass every time its fired . in all calibers and pressure leveles , and i shoot at least 10,000 rounds a year now and i used to shoot alot more in a year for 10 years when i shot in various types of pistol matches 2 to 3 times a week .

[BD]

I wash my .45 acp brass five gallons at a time with simple green in plastic buckets, then rinse and dry in the oven on "low". Don't know what the temp is but the brass still lasts forever. I started doing this about three years ago in an effort to help lower my lead levels. It's made a big difference in the amount of dust I get from the tumbler and the media lasts for months. I'd guess I have cases that have been processed 50 times like this with no ill effects. BD

[monadnock#5]

I asked a friend who works with industrial sized vibratory tumblers at a local bearing factory about ceramics and brass. He said ceramic media would do a fine job, but warned against using a size that was small enough to get inside the cases. He said that when the media gets inside a blind tube, it locks in hard and is very difficult to remove. So I'll stick with walnut and corncob media, as I like the fact that the cases come out almost as clean on the inside as the outside. However, if anyone has some positive practical experience with ceramic and cases, let me know the size and shape and I'll see what a hundred pound bag goes for. I'm thinking GB

Ken.

[georgeld]

I process brass by the buckets full it seems. At least there's a bunch of half or more filled buckets in the room.
Most of the time I'll work on one size til it's all done.

Using RCBS lube it's a sticky mess. But, it's water soluable. I just rinse in the sink with hot tap water and no soap, Seems to be just fine and gets them cleaned well.

Put them in the bucket top media sifter, once they've dripped as well as they can and been shaken a bunch I'll set that over a floor heat vent til they're dried. many times they'll set there over night. Don't matter as I live alone now and can get by with it without catching hell.

I just ordered 40# of corn media from Powder Valley for $17.50, they shocked me bad two days after it was shipped when I saw the invoice for $18.03 shipping on it. That makes it unreasonably expensive in my opinion. 40# of corn $35.53.
Just telling this so you'll be aware of it.

[slughammer]

Hmm, I must have missed this thread first time around. I didn't see anyone mention using a fan.

When something dries, the water molecule jumps into the air and goes away. The use of a household fan at room temp works wonders on drying time in any kind of indoor environment. No need to elevate temperature.

A fan also comes in usefull for thawing out frozen meat; simply put the wrapped meat on the counter and have a fan blow room temp air across it. Works great and the results are the same as letting it thaw slowly.