I Need Educaton on Rifle Bullets

[Josh Smith]

Hello,

I have another Mosin-Nagant. I did not grow up with rifles, just shotguns, pistols an rimfires as I live in Indiana and firearms are largely dictated by what we can use to kill deer.

Regardless, I do like rifles now and again to play with, and I wanted something cheap in the .30-06 class, so I bought an $80 Mosin-Nagant, put one of my modified adjustable front sights on it (something I sort of do on the side) with a target post, and proceeded to turn out an 80 yard 0.6 MOA group with the danged thing.

I have a few accuracy tricks I applied to it, but it still looks like a MN.

Now, I went to buy more ammunition for it. Nobody in town has any -- at least, not that I'm willing to buy. The MN takes a .311" or so bullet, and domestic manufacturers use .308 bullets. Not good accuracy and more than a dollar a shot.

Big R has a few, but they made me not want to come back, so I didn't buy anything from them.

The gunstore is closed until Thursday.

So.... I've decided I need to cast and reload for this round. I was forever running out of .45acp; now I make it faster than I burn it!

Now, I get the whole reloading thing. It's fairly simple and straightforward, and I'd be weighing each charge as opposed to turning them out as fast as possible.

I figure I could buy some powder, have the scale, can prime off the press, need a shell holder, I'll need a case trimmer but can use a file in the meantime. Pretty much I just need components and dies.

However, bullet are another matter.

I do not know what I need to do to cast bullets for rifles, and this is a problem. Gas checks -- do I need them? How badly would a properly lubed hardcast bullet lead up a bore? I'm thinking about driving a 125grn boolit to around 3000fps -- that's actually a somewhat light load for that weight as the 148grn surplus ammo run 2800fps +.

Or should I look at 180grn boolits and run them around 2400 to 2500?

I have yet to slug my bore; I'll do that before I start ordering.

Right now I just need to get an idea of what I need to do, and one of my main concerns is melting the lead in the barrel or eroding the throat with improper techniques.

I suppose it would be easiest to act like I am new to casting and reloading, though I have lots of experience with pistol rounds.

I appreciate it, folks. Thanks in advance!

Josh

[dverna]

Start with a load in the 1200-1500 fps range. Cast bullets over 2200 fps are not for beginners. Walk before you run.

For punching paper, why does it matter? The lighter loads are easier on the shoulder too.

The heavier bullets with a large meplat are preferred for knockdown power.

Don

[Larry Gibson]

You might want to get Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook and read it. That will give a "basic" education and a basis to go from. Pluss you will get a lot of data for that and other cartridges. As mentioned, your velocity expectations with any accuracy comparable to the .6 moa you've gotten are way to high for cast bullets. Your best accuracy with rilfe and cast bullets will be in the 1800 - 1900 fps range. Above that takes knowledge and skill. Not wanting to throw water on your fire but you need to learn from the bottom up, just like the rest of us did.

Larry Gibson

[Jim]

Josh, plus one on what Larry said about Lyman's book. You'll never regret it. It is definitely one of my three "go to" books.

[BABore]

Check out this thread for a similar request as yours.

http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=99495

When looking for a boolit, slug the bore if you want, but do an impact slug of the throat. It is big and long. This is what you need to fill with your boolit. The bbl will size it down once it gets there straight. Also check the ID of your fired case. All that slop needs to be filled up with boolit for you to progress towards your goal. Little if any of this is mentioned in the Lyman Cast manual.

[Josh Smith]

Hi Folks,

Someplace I have that handbook. It's probably on my workbench.

I do believe I skipped over the part on rifles though.

My main question, at this point, is simply this: Will I have to use gas checks?

Thanks,

Josh

[NHlever]

In .30 caliber you will probably need gas checks once you go over 1500 fps, or so. If you want to get any where close to 3000 fps you should just buy jacketed bullets. There are plenty of choices in .310-.311 diameter bullets from makers like Hornady, Speer, and Sierra. In general cast bulllet alloys are not strong enough to withstand the pressures, and thrust against the rifling that it takes to get to the speeds you are seeking without using very advanced techniques like paper patching. Now someone will probably write in that they do it all the time, but I have been unable to so these words come from my experience only. Actually I have been so happy with what I can do with cast at the normal cast velocities that I've never tried in the 50 or so years I've been casting.

[Bret4207]

Josh you aren't going to drive a cast boolit at 3K or even 2800 anytime soon, no matter if it's got a GC or is HARDCAST or not. Start low and slow and learn waht it takes to get good repeatable accuracy at 14-1600 fps. Stuff over 2K is Masters level, over 2400 is genius level cast shooting.

[mpmarty]

"I do it all the time"

[NHlever]

Thanks Marty......... I'm having kind of a rough day, and I really needed to smile! :D :D