Pics Of My First CBs

[b2948kevin]

So, I've been lurking on here for a while, and a few weeks ago I took the plunge and bought some equipment to begin casting Boolits. This was prompted by the cost of buying bullets for my .500 S&W ($45 per 20 for ammo, and $.25 each for bullets alone [smilie=b:).

I found a scrap yard that had some laed and had to pay $1 per pound for corroded diving weights. I bought 50 lbs just so that I could get going, but I am hoping to be able to find some much cheaper sources soon. The good news is that these weights were alloyed already as the are much harder than raw lead. The bad news is that I'm not 100% sure what exactly is in them.

I took the weights and melted them down in my new Lee pro 4-20, fluxed with paraffin, scraped the nastiness off the surface and poured ingots with the help of my wife's muffin tin :). I then took the much improved material and began casting in my new Lee mould for .50 caliber 440 grain with gas check.

Take a look at the results. I certainly learned through trial and error what a good bullet looks like, and what a poor one looks like. I am sure that there's a lot of improvement needed still, but for having just learned through reading this forum, I feel like I'm doing alright. The two bullets with gas checks are a couple that I deemed good, and the ones in the background are a few from the "not so good" pile for comparison.

[b2948kevin]

Here are some pics of the good bullets. Anyone see anythign wrong with these?

[462]

Welcome, b2948kevin.

You did okay, for your first casting session. However, there are inclusions in the boolits. Thorough fluxing should take care of it.

Drive bands should be more defined, too...perhaps the addition of some tin or getting the mould closer to the spout will help.

Otherwise, you seems to be on the correct path.

[Trey45]

I agree with 462. You're on the right path, you need more fluxing, and you need some tin in your melt to give you a better fillout. A hotter mold may help. Regardless, you have taken the first steps towards bullet independence, congrats, and welcome to the addiction.

[onondaga]

They look pretty darn good. You got good suggestions to improve fill-out.

I cast and load for .500 S&W Mag and both the bullets I use are plain base bullets. My shooting is with a rifle, the NEF Ultra Rifle.

My favorite bullet is from the Lee R.E.A.L 250 gr muzzle loading bullet. I size it to .501 and load it to 1885 fps for my rifle. Group size is <1 in. at 50 yd for my grandson or myself.

My other bullet is the plain base RCBS 50-340-SWC. These drop .504" and weigh 365 gr with my wheelweight:Lino Alloy mixed 7:3 at a 7 day measured BHN of 14.

I use BPI Original filler over the powder to the case mouth then seat and crimp in my .250 gr bullet load;
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c338/rhymeswithwhat/500Bal.jpg
The BPI acts as a quasi gas check and seals the plain base bullet well.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c338/rhymeswithwhat/TLsized.jpg

Unsized/Sized

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c338/rhymeswithwhat/bullets.jpg
My loads

I don't know what you are looking for in a .500 S&W load but if it is velocity, .45 cal cast bullets can be used with ML sabots in the .500 with extreme velocity. Check out loads #303 and #304 on this page:

http://www.reloadersnest.com/frontpage_handgun.asp?CaliberID=61

I can provide additional info if you PM me.

Gary

[b2948kevin]

Thanks for the replies!

BTW, I do have gas checks and a sizer, just haven't gotten that far with these yet.

Also, I did flux using parafin wax placed on top of the melt. It burned off but didn't seem to do anything really. Should I be mixing this in?

[Trey45]

ALWAYS mix the flux in, I use a wooden stick, the carbon in the wood acts as a flux agent as well as whatever you're using for flux.

[onondaga]

The bullet you have has pretty abusive recoil with about any reasonable charge behind it. The R.E.A.L. 250 is much lighter and pleasant to shoot and so are the sabot loads with moderate charges. I am sure you will have fun and hope you get to try some lighter bullets in your .500 as well.

Yes, stir well with the flux burning, then skim. After that, with your bottom pour pot, just cover the surface of the melt lightly with saw dust and cast till the metal is low. Put your sprues to the side and don't add them till a new melt.

Gary

[b2948kevin]

Thanks for the reply. I'll try mixing the flux in better tonight. I hope I didn't do too much damage to my mix already. I pulled a lot of gunk out that may have been usable.

Onondaga, Thanks for the advice. I certainly would like to experiment with other bullet moulds. I got this one because it was on sale, and also because I forsee myself shooting the .50 Beo also. This was a bullet that I could find loads for both in. I'm looking for a mould for the bullets that you cast right now :-o

Also, why not add the Sprues right away? Is this because it will lower the temp of the melt?

[onondaga]

Adding sprues while casting does lower the temp, but that is not the biggest problem. Lowering temp also causes the the added metal to not alloy completely with the existing metal in the pot and you will get tin on the top of the melt. For the tin to get thoroughly back into your alloy you would have to bring the temp up and re-flux. If the temp is not brought up sufficiently with the sprues the important tin will be skimmed off looking like impurities when it is not. This will change the hardness and casting quality of your alloy and degrade bullet consistency and quality.

I use a 8X8" aluminum brownie pan to cut sprues over and they stay there till there is only 1 inch of metal left in the pot. Then I add new ingots and sprues for a new melt, flux and sawdust to start casting again. This method keeps my BHN tests very constant for me.

Also, those sabot loads are hot! I have shot them from my rifle and clocked them at 2458 from my rifle with Lil Gun. But they only grouped 3.7" from my rifle at 100 yd. My R.E.A.L. load groups <2" @100yd.

I have been considering sending out my RCBS mold out to have a big hollow point pin fitted to it and hopefully lower the bullet weight 50 grains or more. Then it would be a more enjoyable bullet for me to shoot.

One of the fellows at my club tried my R.E.A.L. loads in his handgun. He immediately started casting and sizing and loading just so he could use that bullet, he liked it that much! He had only used factory ammo before in his .500 S&W and now he can afford his truck payments again!

The RCBS mold is not in stock at Midway currently but if you click on "Notify Me" and follow the instructions they will notify you immediately when in stock. Link:
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=246337

But seriously, the R.E.A.L is only $19.49 for a 2 cavity mold and a Lee lube and Size Kit .501" with lube is a pittance also from Midway:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=130069

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=411862

If you really like heavy bullets, the R.E.A.L is also available in a 320 gr version for the same price:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=475901



Gary

[45nut]

Also, why not add the Sprues right away? Is this because it will lower the temp of the melt?
I find it skews your casting tempo and leaves you looking more at the stuff you dont need to be concerned about, the piles of the sprues and the boolits will take care of themselves, pay attention to what your mold is doing for you, not the trivial matters.

Welcome to the board, enjoy the new obsession!

[stubshaft]

I find it skews your casting tempo and leaves you looking more at the stuff you dont need to be concerned about, the piles of the sprues and the boolits will take care of themselves, pay attention to what your mold is doing for you, not the trivial matters.



I guess it boils down to what you are used to, and the cadence you cast with. When using that Lee mold I usually find it need to cool down at times and that's when I put the sprues back in the pot (20# pot). When casting smaller boolits or HP's because of the need to keep the mould hot I may not have the chance to return the sprues for a while. I don't usually find much of a temperature drop when adding the sprues back in.

You will have to develop your own style of casting and find out what works for you. From the looks of your boolits you are well on your way.[smilie=2:

[Boolseye]

Welcome, and congrats. They look good, and will undoubtedly shoot fine. +1 on fluxing, adding a little tin, and keeping your mold hot. If it's an aluminum mold (Lee) it needs to be really hot–I dip mine into the melt for up 40 seconds before I start. The boolits may be frosty, but they will fill out, assuming your alloy is nice. Then cast as fast as you safely can, otherwise the mold temp will drop (less so with a massive boolit like that .50 cal) You can cut the sprues within a few seconds of each cast. I flux to excess, a nice chunk of paraffin (yep, mix it in–it may burst into flames, which is fine, just be aware. You can touch it off with match off you want). Then put 2-3 tablespoons of fine sawdust in, mix it up and let the blackened soot rest on the top of the melt–keeps your alloy from oxidizing and losing precious tin. Be aware of the tinsel fairy!! Any water at all, even condensation from a cold ingot mold or casting tool, can have explosive consequences, throwing molten lead everywhere. Finally, take it slow and don't stress over the inevitable mess-ups as you learn the ropes. It's all part of the process–you will be flying before ya know it.
-jp

[snuffy]

I took the weights and melted them down in my new Lee pro 4-20, fluxed with paraffin, scraped the nastiness off the surface and poured ingots with the help of my wife's muffin tin .

That right there is why you have slag/dirt inclusions in your boolits. You should NEVER melt scrap lead in a bottom pour pot.You have dirt/crud trapped under the lead at the bottom of the pot near the pouring spout.

Those diving weights should have been smelted in a separate pot. A dutch oven cast iron pot over a turkey fryer propane burner works great for this.

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/arrow/websize/P7210033.JPG

Your solution right now is to flux the living daylights out of the existing lead in your pot, scrape the inside sides and bottom to knock the dirt loose so it can float out. Then dump about half into a muffin tin or something to make an ingot in,(using the bottom pour spout). That should get rid of that dirt. If it don't, you may need to completely empty the pot, then let it cool down to give it a good cleaning.

[b2948kevin]

Thanks for all of the advice! Onondaga, it's going to take me a couple of days to digest what you've just said :)

Stubshaft, I noticed that I had to let the mould cool down a bit. At one point after getting what I thought was a good cadence, I opened the mould and the bullet wasn't solid yet! Lesson learned, and I slowed down a bit and found that they started coming out a bit better.

Snuffy, you're probably right. I'll flux the daylights out of the next pot and scrape the bottom.

Here's a stupid question: I pulled out my bullet sizer to run the newly cast bulets through. I fitted the gas checks on ahead of time and lubed a couple up. When I tried to size these, they got stuck in the die. I finally got one unstuck and then tried without the gas check and it worked great. Should I be fitting the gas checks onto the bullets before sizing or after?

[mpmarty]

I use a gloved hand to cut the sprue on my Lee molds and drop the cut sprue back into the pot. Takes no more time than leaving them on the table and slows down the lead dropping in the pot. Most of my sprues are quite large. I keep saw dust and shavings on top of the melt and stir with a wooden stick frequently while casting.

[bigboredad]

You can buy a better mix of lead right on the forumin the swappin and sellin section for about the same price you paid and it will be delivered to your door. As was stated earlier you'll want to clean up your lead in a separate pot. You can go expensive or cheap. The turkey frier is a great way to go but if cost is a problem you can get buy with a hot plate or a coleman camp stove and a pan from a goodwill style store to get you going then add to your set up as funds permit.

[Wrbjr]

Great job and excellent pictures by the way!

[onondaga]

Your bullet sticking in the die may just be that die was new and dry. or have a rustproofing film on the inside. Clean the die with solvent and brushing then dry it out and oil it with a swab. .500 bullets are big and a little harder to size but using your press and a Lee Lube and Size Die shouldn't be that hard. I size from .513 to .501" with my die. It was hard and sticky when new, so I polished it inside.

Possibly polishing the inside of the die may be in order. Take a good look in there when it is clean. It should be a smooth and shiny tapering hole. You can polish the inside a number of ways . A slotted dowel with oiled 400 grit paper in the slot put in a drill with 10 -20 brief passes through the die will do it. Don't use slow speed of the drill and slow passes, that will cut too much metal. So keep the passes brisk with a high speed running drill and you will just shine the inside instead of changing the size of the die.

That works for me. I have also used the slow speed intentionally to enlarge die size for a different purpose. But, just polish yours unless you really do want bigger diameter bullets. See what you have first after polishing.

Gary

[b2948kevin]

I finally got a chance to clean my sizer out and I sized a few of them this evening. Everything works finally!

I will post pics as soon as my powder and primers come in and I have completed reloads.

[303Guy]

I only use a wooden stick for fluxing and stirring and scraping the sides of the pot. Another trick is to cover the melt with Kitty Litter. This helps keep the metal warm and also keeps the carbon produces by stirring/fluxing on top of the melt. Dippung the ladle through the Kitty Litter is easy. Just run the ladle down the side of the pot. There is never any skimming.

[b2948kevin]

Ok, as promised, here are the pictures of my boolit casting take 2. I did a lot of experimenting the second time around and I'm able to identify a mould that's too hot or too cold now. I fluxed really well and these seemed to be more consistent.

Also, I put gas checks on some of them and ran them through the sizer. Let me know what you guys think.

Couple of questions: what does it mean when the boolits come out frosty looking? Shiny looking?

[462]

Frosty boolits indicate a too hot mould, shiney not hot enough. Frosty's okay, shiney may not have complete fill out, rounded bases, etc. Torn bases indicate the sprue cutter was opened too soon. Can't tell if what appears to be inclusions are actually inclusions or reflections from the cloth.

Still, for only your second cast, you are on the right track. Keep at it.

[b2948kevin]

Thanks 462! That helps a lot.

With my first attempt, there were certainly inclusions, but with this latest batch, I'm proud to say that the majority of what may look like inclusions are just reflections from the cloth.

I'm looking for new moulds now... See what you guys make me do?

[462]

"I'm looking for new moulds now..."

It will only get worse.

Honestly.