Lymann 358477 dropping 5 grains less

[gtivan]

I am a new caster. Before I broke a screw for the sprew plate last night, I was in the middle of my 2nd casting session. Concentrating a lot on consistancy. I believe I got the consistancy, but the boolits are dropping at 145-144 grains and not 150. Believe to be a older mold. What up?

Are the variances on the first cast worth worrying about? Or go ahead and size/lube and shoot?

1. Using ladle.
2. My own mix of Lyman #2 (90/5/5)
3. Close to freezing, but was in garage with door open.
4. Dial on pot was 650. Double checked with thermometer. It is very close.

Other specs and pictures below.



http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l270/rippg/HPIM1459.jpg

[gtivan]

my copy paste didnt wor too well on the specs.

1st run of 15 weighed(rounded to nearest whole grain)
3@ 147
2@ 146
9@ 145
1@ 144

2nd run of 15 weighed (rounded to nearest whole grain)
10@ 145
5 @ 144

2@ 0.0359
9@ 0.0360
4@ 0.0361

Mix
3.00 lbs Stick on Wheel Weight (100% lead)
3.375 lbs Linotype (84% lead / 4% tin / 12% antimony)
0.50 lbs Pewter (92% tin / 8% antimony)
7.00 lbs clip on Wheel Weight (95.5% lead / 0.5% Tin / 4% antimony)

[Kirk Miller]

No need to worry. I may be mistaken, but I believe that when the older molds were made, lead and tin were the alloys used. That combination results in a heavier boolit.

I too, use a couple of older round groove 358477 molds. One four cav. and another in two cav. Both molds drop boolits at 146-147gr. with ww+ 2% tin. I'm sure that if I used a lead tin alloy with no antimony, I'd wind up with a heavier boolit.
Kirk

[Mk42gunner]

gtivan,

I don't worry about the design weight of the boolit, as long as it is fairly close. Lyman molds can have a very large discrepancy due to them changing designs (round or square lube grooves, for example) and just who made the cherry that cut the cavity.

I would be more concerned with your variation in diameter. Are you holding the handles consistantly?

Robert

[wallenba]

Lyman #2 mix displaces some lead with tin and antimony which are lighter than lead. So the end result is by volume a little less in weight than pure lead which may be what your mold was for.

[gtivan]

Cool.

1st time out I was holding the mould freehand and pouring.

2nd time i was placing the mould on the side plate of the smelting pot to pour. got a lot more consistancy on my weights.

Was not concentrating on how i was holding the handles. may have been switching holds.

Right under 300 bullets cast in my life so i am sure i have a lot fo technique to work on.

Thanks for the advice.

[HATCH]

I cast with pure WW and it comes out @152 on average

[9.3X62AL]

I think you're doing fine! A 1% variance in either direction is better than needed for most revolver ammo.

[HeavyMetal]

Heck changing brands of WW metal will net you that much change!

I wouldn't worry about it, it is good that you know what they weigh I treat every casting session as a different lot number and don't mix different lots because of weight change.

By the way I just finished swapping out three old style single cavity sprue Plates with one I bought from Red River Rick.

Holy Mackeral what a difference in quality!!!

Rick does make DC plates and they come with the hold down bolt you broke. Trust me buy a kit and upgrade the mold you have!

Rick's plates are twice as thick as the stock Lyman and recessed to help hold th washer in place. He just qouted me like 12.50 for the DC kit what a deal!

I will soon be heating up my lead pot and se how much easier it is to keep base's nice n square and filled out with the new plates!

[peerlesscowboy]

I just randomly picked out six 358477's that I cast about a month ago from Ly#2 alloy (9 lbs clip on WW to 1 lb 50/50 solder); weights varied from 150.5gr to 151.5gr. Diam varied from .362" to .3625" :neutral:

FWIW, your weights seem pretty consistent. I wouldn't worry about the fact that they're two or three grains lighter than nominal, that could be caused by a number of non-problematic factors. I......like Robert said, would be more concerned about your variation in diameter. Are you sure you're mik'ing them each in the same place in relation to the mould part?

John C. Saubak

[casterofboolits]

Dropping a little light won't hurt a thing as long as the weights are consistant. You could add another pound of pure lead to your alloy and get closer to the 150 grain weight.

I have two Lyman four cavity 358477 moulds and they both drop 150 +/- one grain with my alloy.

[beagle]

My mould (DC Lyman) drops bullets that weigh 153 grains lubed.

Don't worry about it. The 358477 is a mould that had had many different cherries cut by Lyman and you'll see all kinds of variations in size and weight as it's a popular mould.

As long as the diameter's big enough to clean up in sizing they'll shoot all right./beagle

[gtivan]

I just randomly picked out six 358477's that I cast about a month ago from Ly#2 alloy (9 lbs clip on WW to 1 lb 50/50 solder); weights varied from 150.5gr to 151.5gr. Diam varied from .362" to .3625" :neutral:

FWIW, your weights seem pretty consistent. I wouldn't worry about the fact that they're two or three grains lighter than nominal, that could be caused by a number of non-problematic factors. I......like Robert said, would be more concerned about your variation in diameter. Are you sure you're mik'ing them each in the same place in relation to the mould part?

John C. Saubak

Tell ya the truth, I suck at measuring with calipers. I take 3 measurements and use the average. I measure the diameter by putting the boolit in lengthwise down so the caliper is across multiple bands. I just make sure i do not use a measurement that also goes in line with where the moulds meet. What is the term for that line anyway?

[peerlesscowboy]

.......... I just make sure i do not use a measurement that also goes in line with where the moulds meet. What is the term for that line anyway?
Dunno' :confused: that's what I was referring to when I called it the "mould part" :mrgreen:

[gunplumber]

its nothing to worry about, molds throw different weights with different alloys. i casting a mold thats listed at 490 gr but with my 20 to 1 it throws 477gr, and i have another that is listed at 405gr and it consistantly throws 410gr. the pistol molds i have i dont even weigh those.

[Bret4207]

We call that the seam, where the moulds halves meet.

[gtivan]

Thank you for naming that sucker. So do you measure the seam or not when determining the diameter of a fresh cast boolit?

[rintinglen]

No, you do not.
It is not uncommon to have a slight (.0005-.001) bump at the seam.
It gets ironed out duing sizing and has no discernable effect on accuracy, at least when used in Iron sighted revolvers. If you measure a boolit that is under size every where else at the seam, it might seem to be ok, but end up being a smidge undersized. Then you wonder why you get leading and worse groups.

[JIMinPHX]

You broke a sprue plate screw? You may be waiting too long before cutting your sprue. You also may need to sharpen up the cutting edge at the base of your sprue hole.

Your variation in weight is not gigantic, but it is there. If you look at the low weight boolits, do they have nice sharp base corners on them? Or are the corners rounded a bit?

Can you post some pictures of the boolits?

[9.3X62AL]

Your variation in weight is not gigantic, but it is there. If you look at the low weight boolits, do they have nice sharp base corners on them? Or are the corners rounded a bit?

Good point that I overlooked.

[peerlesscowboy]

Thank you for naming that sucker. So do you measure the seam or not when determining the diameter of a fresh cast boolit?
The "seam", that'll work for me :mrgreen: ...no you wouldn't measure the seam. Altho' it's possible you'd find the bullets are slightly out of round if you compared measurements right beside the seam to 90 degrees from the seam. Also when mik'ing a bullet I try to avoid the edge of the base by placing the caliper jaws slightly diagnal in case there's a hint of a fin right at the base.

John C. Saubak

[gtivan]

You broke a sprue plate screw? You may be waiting too long before cutting your sprue. You also may need to sharpen up the cutting edge at the base of your sprue hole.

Your variation in weight is not gigantic, but it is there. If you look at the low weight boolits, do they have nice sharp base corners on them? Or are the corners rounded a bit?

Can you post some pictures of the boolits?

Yep, I broke the screw. My own damn fault. I had sprayed it with break cleaner the night before, and didn't relube the screw. Then when i heated up the mould before casting, the screw appeared way loose, si I tightened it up again. It started out okay but then started to seize as the session went on. At around 100 bullets the damn thing snapped off on me.

Very hard learned lesson on that one I suppose.

I would say I waited 5 seconds on average after the pour to open it up. Maybe a hair longer. Enough time for the lead to have the inital glaze come off, atleast for the stuff on top of the sprue.

I looked close at the bases as I opened up the mould. I threw back 10% or so when I saw it wasn't a good fill out. I didn't look that close at the difference in the last batch i did when weighing to see if the bases were exactly square or not. I assume that they aren't all great, 300 cast in life will not equal precision. Will check into it, i assume that will be the most likely reason.

I will see if my son can take pics and upload. It is a skill I have purposely not learned, otherwise the wife would be bugging me all the time to do it for her.

Time to go play in the snow and brake out a couple of recent purchases. S&W 4566 and a Remington 1917 are begging to be fired.

[gtivan]

The "seam", that'll work for me :mrgreen: ...no you wouldn't measure the seam. Altho' it's possible you'd find the bullets are slightly out of round if you compared measurements right beside the seam to 90 degrees from the seam. Also when mik'ing a bullet I try to avoid the edge of the base by placing the caliper jaws slightly diagnal in case there's a hint of a fin right at the base.

John C. Saubak

Thanks, and to the others who mentioned the "seam".

[higgins]

Since 358477 is a "typical grease groove" design rather than microgroove, don't forget to add the weight of the lube. I have a note in my notebook that 5 bullets cast of wheelweights, sized, with full grease grooves, averaged 150.2. I have two 358477 molds. I didn't note whether that was from the old SC or the newer DC. Since I didn't note which one, I suspect it's from the 60s-vintage SC.

[JIMinPHX]

...

Time to go play in the snow and brake out a couple of recent purchases. S&W 4566 ...
That whole series of .45s is a favorite of mine. They are hard to find & usually pricey when you do find them, but that's where my list of complaints ends.