First Kill with 11.4x74R Wildcat Contender

[MikeP]

A year or so ago I developed a wildcat for my 10-inch .45/410 Contender barrel using the longest brass case I could find to fit into the long chamber of the .45/410, the 9.3x74R European round. Loaded with a 300-grain cast lead bullet, my little 10-inch barrel Contender has proven to be quite accurate compared with a standard .45 Colt round in that gun. This is because the long, almost three-inch brass case allows the unfired bullet to get very close to the rifling of the Contender barrel, whereas the .45 Colt bullet has a couple of inches of freebore gap before it hits the lands at high speed.

This year I got to try the long case / short barrel Wildcat on game. I was sitting in the woods and spotted a nice four-point whitetail coming down a trail about 30 or so yards away. I was hoping he would pass right in front of me for a classic broadside shot, but instead he took a turn away from me, so I had to hurry the quartering-away shot. I quickly centered the crosshairs on the rear of his about-to-disappear ribs to drive the bullet forward through his chest, and fired. The deer ran ahead, away from me, for perhaps 50 yards or so. The big cast lead bullet had passed completely through him, smashing his liver and the tip of one lung. He did not bleed much externally, but his chest cavity was a bucket of blood when I field-dressed him.

So, my Contender wildcat, which I call an 11.4 x 74R, proved itself with its very first shot at game. I do not have it loaded very hot, around 900 fps with the 300 grain bullet, as my goal was not to recreate the .45/70, but an accurate .45 Colt. This I have done. I tried the little barrel with more powder, but it kicked and snorted way too much for my aging joints to handle anymore. I shot the four-point buck with a brass case that I had already reloaded 15 times in developing the load, so it is a mild load indeed.

In earlier hunts with this barrel, I have killed squirrels with a three-inch .410 shotshell. It does a good job as a .410 within 25 yards or so with the choke in the barrel.

If I had to pick a gun to put in a backpack for wilderness survival, this would be it. From feathers to fur, I believe the .45/410 Contender can't be beat.

[ron brooks]

Way to go. Good job.

Ron

[45nut]

who stocks that brass? I have been wanting to do a variation on that theme myself but using some brass .410's I picked up at a cabela's. I believe the name conjured up for this version is the .450Mongo or something like that.
It sure sounds like you have a winner there,I would sure like a picture if you have the capability.

[MikeP]

Hi 45 nut. Somewhere in the archives I believe there is a discussion and pictures from last year. I am computer illiterate, so someone had to post them for me.

I bought the brass from Midway, I think. It is Norma brass, so it is high quality. But, the price is about a dollar a pop. However, I can't wear the stuff out at my load levels. I believe it could be used as 3-inch .410 shotshell loads in the Contender barrel, too.

[OBXPilgrim]

Well, that was a great idea.

I'm very familiar with the H&R Handi rifles and I know the guys with the .45/.410's are always depressed about the results they get from that set-up.

Just a couple days ago I heard someone talking about the 9.3x74R - I was shocked at how long that joker is - I'd never heard of it before.

How bad were the dies for this wildcat. I'd like to know some more about your load as well, if you wouldn't mind.

[MikeP]

Try this link, buys. The last message has a link to pictures, too.

http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/smf/index.php/topic,73740.0.html

[Buckshot]

..........Ya mean these :-)?:

http://www.fototime.com/6C30D71010176C8/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/628CA3F2355CD9A/standard.jpg

...............Buckshot

[Uncle R.]

VERY cool - and a heck of a good idea. What do you use for dies?

[dragonrider]

Wow, now thats the way to go. Well done.

[MikeP]

Buckshot, you're my hero! You were the one to post the pictures last year, and then again this year. Man, you're the greatest.

About the dies, I believe the threads mention I'm using regular .45 Colt dies to treat the necks only. The rest of the case continues to fit very well without resizing, even after 16 firings at this point. I believe this indicates how mild my loads are in the big case. In fact, the web at the base of the case continues to be slightly smaller than the rest of the case for about a half inch from the rim, since it apparently cannot expand large enough for the large chamber. That's a good reason not to try to hotrod the case for this application. I check for head separation with every firing, and so far have found no evidence of such.

Once again, thanks Buckshot. You Da Man!

[Old Ironsights]

..........Ya mean these :-)?:

http://www.fototime.com/628CA3F2355CD9A/standard.jpg

...............Buckshot

Ok, so I've got a poust up in CastBoolits about trying to do that in my Win 9410 - which is a 2.5" only .410 nominal smoothie.

I really don't think stuffing a .452 or even a .429 down a .410 would be a good idea.

I was thinking about how to crimp a .410 hollowbase nose-heavy (WC/WFN?) into a .444 case to make a 2.45 OAL ".410 super foster" ... so long as I can keep the pressures down.

Since it's a smoothie, I don't figure on too much accuracy, but I would like to get the energies up into the .357 or .40S&W range anyway...

[lar45]

I think the 450 Mongo was with the 444 Marlin case?
CBC makes a 2.5" brass 410 case.
I've tried loading 410 shot shells with the 444 case and it doesn't close in one of my guns. I think the rim is too thick. There is a very slight difference.
You should check to see if the 9410 will close on the 444 case first.
What is the bore size on your 9410? and the choke? Maybe you cold find a 45 mold for a hollow base minnie.
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=576925 here's a 45 hollow base minnie.
Just measured the muzzle on my Stoeger single shot 410 and it is .400" . I'm thinking that an oversized bullet to fit the bore would not be good on the choke.

I have a 50 cal from LEE that I am going to try loading backwards seated flush in my 500 S&W. That should be a huge hollow point, if it flys straight.

What powder charge are you loading in your x74 case? Are you useing dacron or something to keep the powder charge next to the primer?

[Old Ironsights]

I think the 450 Mongo was with the 444 Marlin case?
CBC makes a 2.5" brass 410 case.

I've got some. They are semi-balloon. Pic = Fed & Rem Slugs, CBC .410 & Rem .444. Primer pocket on CBC = .04, .444 = .05.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y180/MrMisanthrope/IMG_5143.jpg


I've tried loading 410 shot shells with the 444 case and it doesn't close in one of my guns. I think the rim is too thick. There is a very slight difference.
You should check to see if the 9410 will close on the 444 case first.

Mine closes on & extracts .444 Rem brass just fine. The extractor grips the rim similarly to the CBC & plastic hulls. Problem is (for both .444 & .410 brass) the OD of unsized brass is about .01 too wide for the lifter to get past a little nubbin in the action. What purpose that nubbin serves (part of the angle eject?) I cannot ascertain - but it does not affect plastic hulls.


What is the bore size on your 9410? and the choke? Maybe you cold find a 45 mold for a hollow base minnie.
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=576925 here's a 45 hollow base minnie.
Just measured the muzzle on my Stoeger single shot 410 and it is .400" . I'm thinking that an oversized bullet to fit the bore would not be good on the choke.

My 9410 is a post 2003 manufacture "traditional" with full Cylinder Bore and no chokes. I haven's slugged it or taken a chamber cast yet (next step) but a .440 Round Ball will not go down at the crown. An unobturated .410 slug (measures less than .398) slides down without full bore contact.

I'm looking at a .408 to .410 ogival wadcutter or Veral's 45FNB at the nose with one lube groove and a HB pin that will let me find the right stabilization depth. Dixie thinks a hollow of 2/3 OAL will be best.

I'm wondering if I can interpolate .45-70 Trapdoor data to this load. Aprox 38-40gr of Slow powder with a long curve. (which?) Keep the pressures below 20,000 and run with it.