Nose Die

[Ben]

I recently obtained a 311291 mold. The nose cast unusually large in my opinion. The nose mikes .305 ". At first, I thought that something was keeping the mold halves from completely closing....but that wasn't it... the nose dia. on this particular mold is just LARGE. The bands and g/c shank have the proper dimensions for a .30 cal. mold, but the nose is just a little bit large for my taste in my particular .30 cal. rifles. I guess that .305" would be great for the 7.62 X 54 Russian or the 7.65 Argentine, or the 303 Brit but I'm not currently shooting any of those calibers. I do shoot a lot of .30 cal. cast bullets out of my many 30-06 and 308 Win. rifles.

My rifles need .301 and .302 nose diameters. So........I contacted Buckshot and asked him to make me a nose 1st sizing die that would size the bullets nose to .302 " without any sizing done to the drive bands of the bullet .
( this die has no lube holes and was ordered that way )

As usual, Rick's work was flawless ! !

Many thanks Rick ! !

See photos......

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/010640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/002640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/011.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/009640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/008640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/007640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/005640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/004640x480.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Nose%20Die%20302%20dia/003640x480.jpg

[94Doug]

Wow, great Idea Ben. Now I can see we all have to buy a range of these dies, by .001 increments.....

Doug

[Ben]

And I started all this 45 yrs. ago to save money............... ? ? ?

[Ben]

Doug:

Now, l'll sort through my many .30 cal. molds to see if some of the " fat .30's " can benefit from the use of this die.

Thanks,
Ben

[GP100man]

No ya did`nt Ben, ya done it so you could shoot more & shoot where ya aimed !!!

[geargnasher]

I've done this with several boolits, one of my favorites was the Lyman 457125 505-grain 45/70 boolit that needed the nose reduced about .003". I used a Lee carbide .44 Magnum sizing die with the decapping rod removed to get exactly what I needed to ride the bore of my FIL's 45/90.

for my Swedish Mausers, I use a .266 Lyman sizing die to nose-first seat the check and size the front two bands to a taper using the taper of the lead-in portion of the die to get .2665" on the first band and .2675" on the second.

But if Buckshot can make one, that's even better!

Gear

[Von Gruff]

I had a similar problem with a nose that was too big as a bore rider, but I went a different road. While the die shown is truly a beautiful piece of works and definately dose the job required of it, if a second rifle had a bore that required a 304 nose a second die would be needed.
What I did was to take an unused die and opened it up enough to take a neck sizing bush and turned down the stem to fit the smallest percieved dia need. The die was shortened to allow a washer under the retaining nut to hold the bush in place. Now if the need arrose I could simple get bushes for any size needed. I could - should fill the lube holes with shot but there hasn't been any lube leakage so havent done so to date. I use a 44 spcl case with a 1/3 of the dia cut out and cut to length so it slips over the adjuster stem on my Lyman 450 so I can size to required depth without having to re-set the depth adjuster every time I want to size noses.

The little screwdriver indicates the limit of nose sizing needed for this boolit in my particular rifle. The bush needs to be set with the size designation down so the radiused entry side is up to meet the boolit.

http://i667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/VonGruff/002-1.jpg


44 spcl case used as a depth set so the adjusting stem can stay set for actual sizing - lubing chores. Some lube is used to keep the 44 case in place.

http://i667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/VonGruff/001-17.jpg

Von Gruff.

[Ben]

Von Gruff :

That certainly is a different approach to the same problem. Looks like you've given quite a bit of thought to your nose sizing system.

[quasi]

what is a nnose? Does buckshot stutter?

[geargnasher]

Musta been one of those stamp sets with a speech impediment. Most of my stamp sets can't pronounce at least one letter, and the "m"s come out saying "wwww" sometimes.

Gear

[Ben]

Nothing like having a little fun......but

Does it look good , or does it work well ?

This one works well.

That " double stamp NN " is of little concern to me and I told Rick that in a PM after receiving the die. Beauty is often times just skin deep.

Ben

[Larry Gibson]

Von Gruff was kind enough some time back to send me pictures of his modification. I have since modified an extra .457 H&I die to take the bushings. It works extremely well and I use it to size bullet noses on several different calibers now. With different sized bushings it is easy to get and exact fit for the bullet nose. An additional benifit is that if the bullets already have the GC on and the I die is used as a stop along with a flat face nose punch thebase of the GC is really squared very nicely to the bullet.

My thanks again to Von Gruff. This is not intended to be critical of Buckshot's work or dies BTW. His are also excellent and if just one size is needed they should work very well indeed, just as the OP mentions.

Larry Gibson

[Char-Gar]

Buckshot made me several 30 cal nose sizing dies a few years back. Everyone of them has been spot on for size. I have tested the nose sized bullet against the same design bullet with the as cast nose size as the one that was sized. I have determined that nose sizing DOES NOT degrade accuracy.

[Ben]

Chargar :

After reading your comments, I'm feeling better about this nose sizing all the time.....

Ben

[Char-Gar]

Ben.. I ran some test with several 311291 molds and a Browning Tradition Hunter in 30-30, which is a cast bullet tack driver.

One mold cast .315X.304 and the other .310X301. I sized the body and nose of the larger one .310X.301 and shot the other unsized. I shot four ten shot groups with each bullet, on the same afternoon. I nose first sized the bodies and used one of Buckshot's nose dies to size the noses.

When, I got through all eight groups (80 shots) were the same when averaged. Accuracy for all 8 ten shot groups was 1.1 MOA. The largest group was about 10% larger and the smallest group about 10% smaller. There seemed to be no pattern to which bullet was better or worse. I used the factory tang sight and not a scope. Range was 100 yards and there was no wind.

When I got through with that little project, I stopped worrying about sizing ruining a bullets. It was/is my conclusion that is not how much you size, but how your size. Theories are just theories, the holes in the paper are what matters. Others can float theories, but I have no interest in joining the debate. If is settled as far as I am concerned.

I have body dies that run from .309 to .315 (in .001 increments) and nose dies that size .301 and .302. I dote on fat 30 caliber bullets and just size them as needed to fit the individual rifles. I can mix and match the bodies and noses as needed. This may not be the nee plus ultra for the bench rest shooter, but for the guy with a sporter or military rifle, it is all the accuracy the rifles can give.

[Ben]

Charger :

Thank you for your post......... I like your comment :

Theories are just theories, the holes in the paper are what matters.

My old grandfather always told me ...." Son, that paper don't lie ".

Thanks,
Ben

[pdawg_shooter]

I had a similar problem with a nose that was too big as a bore rider, but I went a different road. While the die shown is truly a beautiful piece of works and definately dose the job required of it, if a second rifle had a bore that required a 304 nose a second die would be needed.
What I did was to take an unused die and opened it up enough to take a neck sizing bush and turned down the stem to fit the smallest percieved dia need. The die was shortened to allow a washer under the retaining nut to hold the bush in place. Now if the need arrose I could simple get bushes for any size needed. I could - should fill the lube holes with shot but there hasn't been any lube leakage so havent done so to date. I use a 44 spcl case with a 1/3 of the dia cut out and cut to length so it slips over the adjuster stem on my Lyman 450 so I can size to required depth without having to re-set the depth adjuster every time I want to size noses.

The little screwdriver indicates the limit of nose sizing needed for this boolit in my particular rifle. The bush needs to be set with the size designation down so the radiused entry side is up to meet the boolit.

http://i667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/VonGruff/002-1.jpg


44 spcl case used as a depth set so the adjusting stem can stay set for actual sizing - lubing chores. Some lube is used to keep the 44 case in place.

http://i667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/VonGruff/001-17.jpg

Von Gruff.

Would it be possible to size your post down to fit the screen? Scrolling back and forth to read your post just means I skip most of them.

[Von Gruff]

Would it be possible to size your post down to fit the screen? Scrolling back and forth to read your post just means I skip most of them.

Not sure how to do that pdawg. My posts including pics (on my lap top screen) all show only the same size as the general posting width of the commments. Happy to oblige if and when I learn how.

Von Gruff.

[Ben]

Today I finally had an opportunity to try out my Springfield , 1903 -A3, 308 Win., with Lyman 48 and 17 A front sight. It has always been a super accurate rifle. I felt like it would be a good rifle to test the 311291's that had been pushed into the nose 1st sizing die made by Buckshot to evaluate them in the " accuracy dept."

The 311291's with the fat nose ( .305 " ) were pushed into Buckshot's Nose sizing die and resized to .302".

The distance is 50 yards and a 5 shot group. Needless to say , I can highly recommend Buckshot's nose sizing die !

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Springfield%201903%20-%20308%20Win/9006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Springfield%201903%20-%20308%20Win/PICT00011024x768.jpg

[HARRYMPOPE]

Eagan made these nose sizers called "t" dies with a taper and or and cylindrical section.They are
very useful as you have found out.With soft alloys a nose can also be bumped up.But you will eventually break your lubrazizer.
i use my 22 T and 30 x 1.5 deg T dies quite a lot.

HMP