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Texasflyboy
01-14-2011, 04:30 PM
:grin:

I am a cheapskate by birth and a bullet caster by choice. Those two afflictions led me to making my own targets years ago because I wanted the ability to design targets that would fit my needs then, and into the future when conditions changed.

And over time I realized I wanted to create a database of my loads and what worked with my weapons.

And the final piece of the puzzle was modern electronics in the form of high speed copiers/document scanners that can quickly create a .jpg or .pdf file.

So after 15 years this is what I have:

I make my own targets on card stock purchased cheaply from office supply stores. Office Depot, Office Max, and other big box office supply stores often put damaged or slow moving paper supplies on clearance. I keep a weather eye out for these sales. I've also been known to ask a manager to put old stock at a discount especially if it's covered with dust from sitting on the shelf for a year or two. The last 500 count ream of 8 1/2" x 11" white card stock I purchased cost $5.00 out the door. I purchased a 250 page ream of white card stock in ledger (11"x17") for $10 at the same store, the package had been opened by someone months earlier and the first one or two pages were damaged and dusty.

I take these and using my designs created in MS Word, I print on my office copier. Since I have an agreement with my management team to do this, no harm done to the office budget. So, printing is free.

After shooting, for the 8.5 x 11" card stock, I three hole punch and store in a 3 ring binder that carries the serial number of that firearm. My favorite Model 27 has about 200 pages of targets stored in that binder. Different powders, different bullets, what works, and what doesn't. Loads that work for me are transferred into an excel spreadsheet that hangs over my loading bench. Once a year the targets are removed from the binder and run through a high speed scanner/printer to convert into .pdf format. Once the targets are converted, they go onto a portable hard-drive with my other research.

The larger ledger size targets are used primarily at the rifle range. Once used, groups are measured, recorded on the target and I remove just the group section and transfer to a three ring binder.

Cardstock is preferable that plain white copy paper because it holds up better over time and the bullets cut cleaner holes.

Why go to all this trouble instead of using commerical targets? Since I am the manufacturer, I control the quality and style of target. Once designed, I forever have access to the same handgun target. The 8.5 x 11" size fits into a standard 3 ring binder which solves the storage and retrieval problem. I have been using the same round handgun bulls eye target for 15 years. My eyes have grown accustomed to it. I don't have to remember to buy more, and I never am at the mercy of changing designs.

My database now includes fired targets that number in the 1,500+ range. I have methodically worked through each firearm I own and run target samples to determine which load is best for that firearm, and bullet/powder combo. For handguns, I use the same bulls eye target for every firearm, the same for rifle (which use ledger size targets).

This is the handgun target, simple, easy, and cheap:

http://hgmould.gunloads.com/a/45COLT.jpg

I made it using MS Word and saved it as a .pdf file on my portable hard-drive.

An unexpected benefit of all this standardization and conversion to electronic format is that I always have my data at my fingertips. I never dread long layover's in an airport, nor do I find myself without something to read or review on boring nights when nothing is on TV and my eyes can't take any more surfing.

Another benefit is the data showing me which guns I tend to favor and which are becoming safe queens. I either remedy the situation by taking a safe queen out for a range date or decide if I need to find a more interesting handgun for experimentation. Over the Christmas break last year I realized I had not shot a Smith & Wesson Model 625 Mountain Gun I had bought on impulse years ago. That led me to look for a suitable bullet mould. Which lead me to find a damaged two cavity Lyman 452424 sitting in the back of my mould storage, which lead me to sending it off to Erik Ohlen at Hollow Point Moulds. One thing led to another and I ended up spending the next month enjoyably casting for that new hollow point mould and discovering the loads that worked best in the 625 Mountain Gun. The results are here (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=102225).

Another unexpected benefit was being able to downsize my powder storage. I have Bullseye, Unique, 2400, W296, W231, IMR 4895, & 4064 at my disposal. Except for a large stash of surplus WC820PD, that's my powder magazine. If I can't do it with those powders, I don't do it.

Almost weekly I find myself pulling down a 3 ring binder and going over the data. I review the compiled data, look for trends, look for new interesting combination's, or remember ill-advised trips down bad-powder bullet roads. Those binders sometimes come on a road trip with me, especially on overseas trips when I can't take firearms to play with. Combined with my portable hard-drive, I get to have electronic range time on my schedule, especially when I am awake with Jet Lag at 3AM in a foreign country and nothing understandable is on the TV.

It's never boring but it certainly wasn't expensive which is the golden rule for cheapskates who own guns: Save your money for powder, primers, and lead.

armoredman
01-14-2011, 11:50 PM
Very nice, sir. I also print out my own targets, but only on regular paper, the cheapest recycled I can get. I finally broke down and bought a target stand, as the last one I built finlly died a horrible death and the hands of wayward bullets...oops. I handbuilt several stands when construction was going non stop and I could get scrap lumber free. :)
Never thought of doing the binder, but I have pictorial copies of targets on the hard drive and on photobucket, all of them have load data on them. I also have a really bad word document with load info on it from the years, hate Excel, but that's just me.
Sounds like you have a complete and very workable system, nicely done!

bigjake
01-15-2011, 12:28 AM
You guys are buying too much. one of the best target holders/stands are the cheap signs you see all over the sides of the roads during elections or other cheap signs that people leave there. either the cardboard ones with a U shape wire for legs. you turn the sign inside out then you have a white sign, or the corragated plastic ones where the two wires poke up into the corragated holes.
For targets, you use cheap paper plates with a shot of black spray paint in the center. you dont need to be conservative with these targets.

Recluse
01-15-2011, 12:32 AM
Well, I reckon I'm cheaper than you. :)

I simply use those solid white little 3 x 5 index cards. I keep some white masking tape in my gun bag and tape the index cards to used targets other shooters have so thoughtfully left me (along with their once-fired brass :)), and *voila* there is my target.

I write down the data on it underneath the boolit holes (date, caliber, boolit info, powder charge, primer, case, number of shots, distance fired, handheld or rested) and then keep those cards separated by caliber in ziplock bags, stored in a cabinet in my reloading shop.

When I'm working up a load, I put the test rounds in ziplock bags (that I get at The Dollar Store), and write down all the data on a 3 x 5 notecard and put it in the ziplock bag as well.

Same thing when fooling around with alloys or lubes--all recipes and formulas go on a 3 x 5 index card, then filed separately.

I buy stacks of the notecards each July and August during the back-to-school sales. I can find packages of 100 notecards and buy them four-for-a-dollar at Walmart or any of the other Chinagreens/mart stores.

That's 400 targets for a buck. :)

:coffee:

geargnasher
01-15-2011, 12:55 AM
Kudos to you, TFB, and thanks for sharing that.

I use the hard copy (bottom of triplicate) of invoices from my last job. I use card stock like you on overcast days, BigLots! had some sales last year so I stocked up on that, too. My (then) boss gave me ten years of invoices in file boxes, so I'm set for the next 20 years.

Due to the ever-changing conditions of my eyes, I keep a handfull of wide-tip permanent markers in my range bag and make targets on the spot as my needs change.

Gear

PS, it never ceases to amaze me the lengths we'll go to to save a dollar or two. For example, Recluse, how many gallons of avgas did you burn last year, plus your annual inspection, maintenance, etc. etc, so you can do volunteer work, and you buy plastic baggies at the dollar store? Good man.

Gear

Recluse
01-15-2011, 01:12 AM
PS, it never ceases to amaze me the lengths we'll go to to save a dollar or two. For example, Recluse, how many gallons of avgas did you burn last year, plus your annual inspection, maintenance, etc. etc, so you can do volunteer work, and you buy plastic baggies at the dollar store? Good man.

Gear

For me, it's about common sense, priorities and getting the most out of every dollar I spend.

Shooting, casting, reloading is more than just a hobby to me--it's a stress-relieving indulgence that also has a lot of practical value (hunting for food, self-defense of family and property, defense of nation, etc).

I enjoy load and boolit development, so I do a lot of it. I started the notecard thing back when I was in the military and that was about all I could afford. Plus, in the military, you moved around every once in a while and the notecards are small and easy to pack. So, I just kept with them.

When I got married a couple of decades ago, my wife is the quintessential organizer. Is it any wonder she owns a little stock in The Container Store? :) She could spend California out of its recession if I turned her loose in a Container Store.

Anyhow, she loves those Glad ziploc baggies and thought they would make good organizers for me and my test rounds and boolits. That was like six or seven years ago, so I just started buying 'em up whenever I'd find them on sale. Then one day I was at the Boolit Caster's and Reloader's Mecca (aka: The Dollar Store) and lo and behold, I found my beloved Glad ziploc bags for a buck a box!

Had to pinch myself, I did.

On the other end of the spectrum, I believe in the (paraphrased) verse of "To whom much has been given, much is expected." My wife and I have been blessed, to be sure. I enjoy doing the medical volunteer flights and I also fly kids around at Christmas time doing aerial tours over well-decorated neighborhoods. Yesterday, I took a remarkable 15-year-old young lady up to do some aerial photography for her high school's yearbook.

Deal there was. . . her (single) mom was told twice in the past two years that her daughter was going to die due to a rare brain virus which decimated the young lady's cognitive and comprehension skills and abilities. The kid never quit fighting, and today--with the help of some miracle worker doctors and lots of prayers--she is almost back to 100%.

I'd challenged her to never quit fighting and to keep concentrating on her grades in school. She was an A/B student, when the virus hit her, she began to be a D/F student.

You see, she found she could no longer read. . . Of course, she could no longer speak, either. She understood what people told her and what they read to her, but was unable to communicate back.

Long story as to how we met, but I challenged her on her recovery to get her grades and learning abilities back and in return, I'd fly her anywhere she wanted to go and let her take the controls.

And that's what we did yesterday. Her smile lit up the entire cockpit and everyone from the folks at Cutter Aviation to Fort Worth Center air traffic control laid out the red carpet.

If I can save a little money now and then on my hobbies to help steer it towards some of the volunteer and charity work, I figure it's a win-win.

And besides, I'm a stubborn guy and just got too danged comfortable with those notecards. :)

:coffee:

home in oz
01-15-2011, 01:21 AM
Nice electronic system.

HighHook
01-15-2011, 02:00 AM
The old saying goes: Pinch the old nickle so tight you make the Indian ride the Buffalo...

Jal5
01-15-2011, 08:46 AM
Thanks Texas for sharing your electronic system. It gives me some ideas for reorganizing my data. I have some more work to do now during our cold winter months!

RP
01-15-2011, 09:27 AM
All that sounds like great ideals and I would save my targets but heck the target size to get one of my groups on would be folded about 12 times to fit in a notebook.

hunter64
01-15-2011, 10:09 AM
Texasflyboy: I have done the exact same thing that you do for the last few decades. I also have a complete data base of all my powders, bullets. primers and brass as well as dies/tools and of course molds and lube.

All of this goes on an old laptop that I resurrected that has enough horsepower to get on the internet and enough storage for my needs. When I am in the garage and reloading, I have instant answers to my questions at my fingertips.

I have three huge 4" binders that I keep all the targets that are worth keeping that I have shot in the last 35 years and I can instantly go back 20 years when I owned a type of rifle or pistol and see what ran thru it the best.

Charlie Two Tracks
01-15-2011, 10:35 AM
Very good Recluse. I admire your actions and am inspired by them.

JonB_in_Glencoe
01-15-2011, 11:00 AM
And that's what we did yesterday. Her smile lit up the entire cockpit and everyone from the folks at Cutter Aviation to Fort Worth Center air traffic control laid out the red carpet.

Recluse, I was tearfree til I read the above.
Jon

Doc Highwall
01-15-2011, 01:22 PM
Recluse, you are a man of great generosity, Thank You! I was told that when I squeeze the nickel that the Indian cries and the Buffalo shi*s

Shooter6br
01-15-2011, 01:33 PM
I 'm so tight I squeak when I walk LOL

mdi
01-15-2011, 02:01 PM
You're a good man Recluse. Ill-tempered Texan? Mebbe on the outside, but marshmallow inside?

BTW My record keeping is much the same as Texasflyboy's. I use cheapest office paper I can find and copy my "masters". I also have sticky Avery lables for my ammo boxes with the loads (cal., bullet, powder charge, etc) that I can peel off the boxes and stick them on the 8 1/2 X 11, and then punch and put in a 3 ring binder. I have a binder that goes back to 1984 with targets and loads; started this method when I got my first .44 Magnum.

gnoahhh
01-15-2011, 02:52 PM
Good ideas all. Got me to re-evaluate my system.

In terms of targets, I'm even cheaper than all of you. I don't use any. I just fire my groups at the backstop and imagine how small they are.8-)

mpmarty
01-15-2011, 03:50 PM
Best deal I've found is my printer attached to my chrono. Tear off the results, fill in some data and staple it to target. Done.

snuffy
01-15-2011, 07:54 PM
Cheap targets are for me at least, those self sticking bullseyes that either come on a sheet of shiny paper, or just the BE in a plastic tub. They can make a precise aiming point out of any type of paper. Also great for highlighting any plain black bullseye. The ones I use most are florescent orange or yellow.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=182878

I also use the ones in the stickies here on the forum. I usually print them on whatever paper I have in the printer. I may look for some card stock the next time I'm at an office supply store. Not sure how heavy I can go with the hp photosmart printer, it pulls the paper through a sharp "U" turn to print on the bottom of the paper, not sure if it will handle the heavy stuff.

They're hardly free, you have to buy the paper, and the printer cartridges are getting more expensive to replace.

One thing that bothers me is a target holder that won't hold still. My range has pipes that the feet of the holders slip into. The wind can rock them forth and back. Hard enough to shoot good groups, but harder if the target is being blown around on even a slight wind. Flimsy holders like a political roadside signs would be fine in an indoor range, but unusable in any windy outdoor setting, especially now that the ground is frozen.

kelbro
01-15-2011, 11:45 PM
I have always used the Lyman Reloaders Log Book and used to keep my targets. Now I don't see any point in keeping the targets.

When I am working up loads, I put the data on a post-it with the loads and log it into the notebook. While at the range, I put any notes, group size, weather conditions and checkmarks beside the good loads on the post-it and then update the logbook when I get home. Next batches are loaded with the 'checkmark' loads until keepers are determined. Then I load up a batch or two and log them into my book. I can look back through my book at any time and see what worked for each gun, and what didn't.

I do need to take the time to transfer that data to a digital storage medium, just in case. I have been loading for close to 40 yrs. There is a lot of data in that old dog-eared notebook.