Remember this?

[dragonrider]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/PaulGauthier/trapdoor/trapdoor008.jpg
The trapdoor I acquired a few weeks ago, well I finally found out it is an 1873 model, Found it on the breeckblock right where is should be under numerous layers of paint, and it is a fifty caliber. Also got the bore cleaned out and found it is not as bad as I first assumed. There is some minor rust in the barrel but surprisingly no lead, at least according to my Outers foul out II. Took a lot of lead out to fill that barrel.
Went to Trapdoors Galore and found all the parts that I will need to return it to functionality. Not cheap but at least I can get them. $22 for a sear spring, I'll get two.
The stock however is another matter, I pulled all the nails out and now it is in two pieces. And while I can get a stock it is just too expensive right now. Soooo I will be fixing this one, probably take several pounds of epoxy to do it but it should work, I am beginning to think I can turn this into a shooter. :-D

[hydraulic]

Dragonrider:

Interesting piece. If it's a '73 it can't be a 50 cal. They were all .45's. The stock looks like an early '73 as it appears to have the long wrist, but the lockplate doesn't look right. If it really is a 50 cal. it may be one of Bannerman's pieces. He put some trapdoors together using a variety of parts, some of which he made, including sideplates. All Springfields had an eagle and were marked "U.S. Springfield". Could it be one of the earlier .50-70 models, l866, 67, 68?

[dragonrider]

I am quite ignorant of these rifles and am relying on what I find by way of stamps etc.
There is no eagle on the side-plate and no "U.S" only "Springfield". All I know for sure is that it is a 50 cal. Are the breechblocks interchangeable???
"Could it be one of the earlier .50-70 models, l866, 67, 68?" I couldn't possibly know, but if true would this be real problem? I have no allusions of this piece being worth anything. If it can't become a shooter it will hang on the wall. I would like it to be functional and at least look like a shooter.

[45 2.1]

Your piece is not an 1873, that year and forward were 4570s. Your piece is also not a 1866 as the rear sight is different. It very well could be an 1868 or 1870 5070 trapdoor though. You will need to look the sight options up in some of the trapdoor books that are available. I recommend you get it in shooting shape as the 5070 trapdoors are lots of fun to shoot. They make excellent 300 yd shooters.

[hydraulic]

Drgonrider: How did you determine that the calibre was .50? The calibre was not marked on Trapdoors. The breechblock markings should read U.S./Model/1873 if it is really an 1873 breechblock. I am pretty sure that the .50-70 breechblocks were not interchangeable with the .45-70's. The lockplate is definately not a .50-70 lockplate. Those were taken from 1863 and 1864 muskets and the date is stamped at the rear. They were also beveled on the edge. It isn't an 1873 lockplate either. The government sold a lot of parts in the l800's and a large number of trapdoors were assembled by surplus dealers around the turn of the century, using some surplus parts and some they made themselves. I have a notion that yours is one of those.

[floodgate]

Dragonrider:

First, clean the barrel out as well as you can, and slug the bore - that will tell you the caliber for sure (.45-70 should go 0.450" bore, 0.457" to 0.462" groove; a .50-70 will go 0.500 / 0.510" or so; a little tricky as these are - or ought to be - three-groove barrels, but twirl the slug through the jaws of the caliper and you'll get a "good enough" reading).

If it is a .45-70, go to North Cape Publications, 380 So. Tustin Ave., Orange, CA 92666 (or Google up theeir website) and order a copy of Poyer & Reich's "The .45-70 Springfield - For Collectors Only". If a .50-70, hit up Cistern Publications, 14010 State Highway 95 North, Flatonia, TX 78941, and get a copy of Croft Barker's "The .50-70 Shooter's Handbook". Heck, you've got enough value in parts alone to buy several copies of each, if you decide just to part it out; and if (as I'd recommend) you decide to beat it into a "shooter", you will get a good education in 19th-Century weaponry in general and Trapdoors in particular to boot. Keep us posted, and we'll all do our best to help you sort it out. At the very worst, you'll still end up with a handsome wall-hanger, just reeking of history!

floodgate

[dragonrider]

Slugged the bore and got .509" to .514" depending on where I check, three grooves are a pain. Others I have seen in person and in photos show a date on the side-lock behind the hammer, not so on this one. As I mentioned earlier the date on the breech-block is 1873, not original? So if all 1873's and up were 45-70's and breechblocks are not interchangeable, could a 50-70 barrel have been screwed onto an 1873 receiver????
So I will see if I can acquire that book on the 50-70, thanks for that info.
BTW there is really a town called "Flatonia"?, sounds vaguely aromatic.

[floodgate]

dargonrider:

From Frank de Haas' "Single-Shot Rifles and Actions", the 1873 barrels were 1.000" diameter at the receiver, threaded 10 tpi with square-profile threads, 0.900" crest and 0.850" root diameter for x 0.875" long, then a smooth shank for another 0.558". I'll look around and see if I can dig the corresponding numbers for the .50-70. The sight placement just ahead of the receiver ring looks right for a .50-70 barrel; the .45-70 sights were a couple of inches further forward.

Yes, there must be a Flatonia; at least, my check got there and a couple of books came back.

floodgate

[KCSO]

Now for the parts...
Dixie Gun Works still has a good assortment.
Stocks are available from either Boyd's or Dixie.
Numerich GPC Inc. has some parts.
There is also a parts man in Allen Ne. Big John, who has quite a few trapdoor parts. If the barrel is shot out you might want to make this one a wall hanger as it doesn't take too many parts to equal a whole gun in cost.

[drinks]

Flatonia is a few miles south of La Grange, a Czech community of about 1500, last I was by there.
Principal industry was making "Oil-Dry" and cat litter from a deposit of volcanic ash ,also had some rock hunting places, lots of very good wood there, including black palm and cycads.
We had 8 acres between Flatonia and La Grange.